[Interest] MSVC not-the-latest: are you using it? why?

[Roland Hughes]

On 1/24/23 05:00, Thiago Macieira wrote:
> You're talking about the ability to write code given a compiler you can't move
> from and what one needs to do to keep that working. I am asking why people are
> staying with the older one, if the new one is available and shouldn't (in
> theory) produce a compatibility burden with already-compiled code.

Well, Scott actually answered your question. The new version (besides 
not being free) __always__ drops or breaks something. Tony pointed out 
the Enum class debacle and Scott has pointed out others. The newest of 
the new has gone to the God-awful subscription model.

Newer != Better   No matter how much Microsoft wants to charge money for it

This has sparked a groundswell of interest in previously dormant 
projects like OpenWatcom.


http://openwatcom.org

OpenWatcom V2
https://open-watcom.github.io

https://github.com/open-watcom/open-watcom-v2#open-watcom-v2-fork

It has also set a lot of users and companies into the arms of Borland 
once again.

C++ Builder
https://blogs.embarcadero.com/successful-windows-development-with-this-c-compiler-download/

For those looking to play the Microsoft game yet and needing multiple 
licenses, it looks like your "cheapest" entry point is to sign a 
computer leasing arrangement with Dell or Lenovo. From the Dell clients 
I've worked for you have to least __all__ of your computers from them. 
You define N set configurations and they give you an iron clad 24-hour 
turn around for replacement on any of those. With that they will set up 
a "company store" where employees can only install from that store. 
Provide (for additional fee) some certified Microsoft License manager, 
controlled access for installing licensed products, etc.

Big brother wants to own you. They want you to rent a claw hammer month 
by month and if you stop paying you can no longer use the claw hammer.

Pretty much every company going to the "subscription" model for software 
development tools will go under. Companies won't pay it, at least not 
for long. They will move to perpetual license and/or free stuff as 
quickly as possible because your subscription model now made that a cost 
effective decision.

The straightforward answer to your question is: LTS == 15 years not 5

https://www.logikalsolutions.com/wordpress/information-technology/lts/

I will take the medical device answer once step further.

Somewhere between 70-90% of all ER, Post-Op, and ICU units in America 
are still running 32-bit Windows 7. A small percentage are still running 
Windows XP. They are getting shiny new medical devices, including 
advanced surgical robots, and the back-end data feeds must support 
Cerner, Epic, etc. on a 32-bit platform.

Despite what Microsoft and others have publicly said, this situation 
will persist for at least 10 more years and Microsoft will be forced by 
government agencies to continue providing support.

The only "safe" way to upgrade any of those three entities is to build a 
new one either within the same building or in a new wing. You cannot mix 
& match versions in such units because patient risk is too high. 
Building a new unit (or wing) will cost them $24 million to $64 million. 
That includes training staff on new equipment. That takes time and the 
ability to hire enough staff given the post-peak-pandemic burn-out rate.


 > That just means you had to downgrade to the previous minor version of 
2017.

Unless Microsoft has changed its ways, "downgrading" isn't generally an 
option. I got burned by this with Windows 95, an OS that forced 
developers to re-install it multiple times per year. The Install-Shield 
type applications allowed the owner to set a drop dead date. Visual 
SlickEdit and a few Microsoft products came up with the infamous

"This software is too old, you need to buy a new version"

message when attempting to install. Ever since then I've always done 
bare metal backups at least weekly on all machines.

The other issue is that Microsoft (and other software vendors) leave 
trash all over the place when you attempt to uninstall. Registry entries 
and config files will all be looking for a new version that is no longer 
there. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt and hat. No commercial 
software vendor properly tests their uninstalls.

I do hope you read the blog post. The bulk of us developers are the 
roofer with the hammer. We have very little reason to purchase a new 
hammer once we have a hammer that allows us to earn money. We have ZERO 
reason to pay monthly/annual subscriptions to be able to use our hammer 
to earn money roofing houses.

Medical devices, accounting systems, inventory management, to desktop 
applications care absolutely nothing about bleeding edge. One company I 
wrote software for is still (as of circa 2010 anyway) shipping software 
for Apple Performa (sp?) computers that were last made in the early 1990s.

Norton anti-virus still supports 32-bit XP. So do several of the other 
big names.

God was able to create the world in seven days because she didn't have 
an installed base.

-- 
Roland Hughes, President
Logikal Solutions
(630)-205-1593

http://www.theminimumyouneedtoknow.com
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