[Interest] Chasing a standard

[roland at logikalsolutions.com]

Quoting Tomasz Siekierda <sierdzio at gmail.com>:

> On Mon, 5 Nov 2018 at 13:35, Roland Hughes  
> <roland at logikalsolutions.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 11/4/18 3:52 PM, Lars Knoll wrote:
>> >> On 4 Nov 2018, at 22:13, Roland Hughes  
>> <roland at logikalsolutions.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> We already lose droves of Qt developers every year when Qt keeps  
>> moving on but medical devices, border security systems like cargo  
>> x-ray, train control systems, etc. have to fork their own version  
>> of Qt because Qt keeps moving on without a 5-8 year LTS.
>> > Yes, the Open source and standard commercial versions come with a  
>> maximum of 3 years for LTS releases. But you can get longer support  
>> for Qt versions from The Qt Company though.
>>
>> Three years isn't a drop of water in Lake Michigan. A completely new
>> surgical robot will take a minimum of 4 years design and prototyping
>> followed by 1-3 years of development (which must also include the
>> _entire_ manufacturing process for certification.) Then it goes through
>> clinical trials which can last upwards of 7 years. Once released to the
>> field it will be in maintenance/minor enhancement mode for 10 years or
>> more. This entire time the tool set must be locked down.
>
> Since the tool is locked down, then it does not matter if Qt has moved
> on or not, right? You're not allowed to upgrade/ change it anyway, you
> have to stick to what you deployed. So there is no reason to complain
> about lack of support here. That's the reality of such big and long
> term projects. NASA also still keeps operational their computers from
> 1970 to handle Voyager missions. It does not mean that the
> manufacturers of these PC are somehow obligated to support them
> anymore.


This would be a gross missunderstanding of how the FDA "lockdown" is  
actually applied. Minor bug fixes can have documentation generated via  
an FDA approved process with dramatically reduced testing cycle since  
it is mostly negative testing. (Negative testing being testing no  
changes to other existing functionality.) The definition of "minor" is  
totally within the purview of the FDA and argued case by case.

As far as manufacturers and obligations, see below.

>
>> Just this year a drug manufacturer in California fielded a job opening
>> looking for a PDP-11 systems manager familiar with hardware maintenance.
>> Some of you may recall that a PDP-11 was the machine C and UNIX were
>> developed on in the 1970s. It was _the_ midrange computer of its day but
>> hasn't been manufactured since the late 1980s.
>
> And you bring this up because PDP-11 is still supported by its
> (non-existing by since 20 years) manufacturer just like Qt should?

There are quite a few places still providing support for the PDP-11  
line. Quite a few companies stock piled 11/24 and 11/44 machines as  
others moved to VAX, ALPHA, and ITANIUM. Ownership of the line moved  
from DEC to Compaq to HP.

Shortly after Compaq consumed Digital Equipment Corporation, Microsoft  
paid them a bunch of money to announce the death of OpenVMS in a bid  
to get feeble Windows servers running on Compaq PCs into data centers  
where they were previously barred. Some corporations started to make  
the move. The NSA and DOD paid Compaq a Microsoft a visit. They showed  
them the sales and support contracts making cessation of the platform  
an act of treason and informed the leaders of both companies just how  
lengthy their prison time would be. You see, Bill Gates could bribe  
Bill and Hillary Clinton to make the Janet Reno investigation go in a  
"don't put Bill in prison for wire and mail fraud" direction, but the  
DOD and NSA weren't smiling and given their budgets, no interested in  
any bribe either company could offer.

Compaq then announced they weren't killing off OpenVMS and Bill Gates  
stepped out of the go-to-prison hot seat as part of the apology. The  
other details I do not know. I do know there was much more than that  
involved.

NASA had, and probably still has similar contracts.

These long term support contracts are why we have $12 wooden pencils  
and $800 hammers. That __EXACT__ product has to remain available and  
replacable for many many decades. Even if every tree of that type dies  
on the planet, the vendor who signed the contract must still find a  
way to make that __EXACT__ pencil with that __EXACT__ wood and other  
components. There is still a vendor prodiving 8 inch floppies to the  
DOD because they are used to boot the nuclear missile launch systems.  
Given the short life of floppies, they aren' surviving on a eBay  
stockpile. They are actually making them every so often.

If Qt wishes to play in the embedded world, it has to come to grips  
with this reality. It's not a "chase the latest idiot phone trend"  
world. This is why you are starting to see various companies who would  
otherwise consider each other competitors banding together to maintain  
the now abandoned Qt releases. Most every year or at least every other  
year I get emails and calls about doing Qt 3 work on OS/2 from this  
Harman (sp?) consulting firm. Minor changes to an existing medical  
device whose systems were built using those tools.

One of my past clients had almost nothing to do with the DOD post  
WW-II, but, they still have all of the equipment to make torpedos for  
said boats and ships. They must keep it on site in good condition  
until the contract ends. I've been told that contract doesn't end  
until the last vessel of war capabile of firing said munitions is  
scuttled. I have not personally seen the contract, nor do I wish to.  
You will find every major manufacturer which existed during WW-II has  
a similar contract for something else. These contracts don't expire  
until the DOD deems what they manufactured non-strategic and disposes  
of it.

-- 
Roland Hughes, President
Logikal Solutions
(630) 205-1593

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