[Qt-interest] C++ + QT vs C#

[Pau Garcia i Quiles]

On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 7:03 AM, Scott Aron Bloom
<Scott.Bloom at sabgroup.com> wrote:
> Maybe you missed my point.  The project looks very cool..  What doesn't make sense to me... isn't Qyoto... Its C# on unix...

What's wrong with C# on Unix? C# is just another programming language.
Would you say Objective C on Linux is wrong? (the GNUstep window
manager, which works on Unix, is implemented in Objective C)

> C# IMNSHO is purely a "We don't want to pay licensing fees to Sun" language... I am not a huge Java fan, but it serves a purpose...
>
> I understand why MS created/bought and now markets C#.. I have coded quite a bit with it.. however, without a .NET equivalent framework behind it... how will you be able to use it?

There is Mono http://www.mono-project.com/

> My mainsoft comment was this..  MainSofts "purpose" was to provide a MFC and Win32 set of functionality on top of X11 environments.  So that when I wrote my code on windows, I could in theory rebuild it on X11.. and it would run...

MainSoft's purpose was to make easy to port a Win32 application to
Linux without rewriting the code. Pretty much the same thing you can
achieve now with wine.

> So if I write C# on my windows box, if I only wrote C# without any framework calls.. would C# ever be the language of choice?
>
> Isnt that what your providing with a linux version of the .net framework calls...

No.

> I couldn't find on the qyoto site what framework libraries are provided.

Qyoto does not provide any part of .NET. Qyoto only provides the Qt
API but in C++.

>
> Please note... The project does look like a great exercise..  Im just not sure of the viability of the C# language for anything besides... MS windows development.

Given that there are a lot of Unix and Mac applications developed in
C# using Qyoto and Gtk#, I'd say you are wrong.

>
> Scott
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Pau Garcia i Quiles [mailto:pgquiles at elpauer.org]
>> Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 8:39 AM
>> To: Scott Aron Bloom
>> Cc: qt-interest at trolltech.com
>> Subject: Re: [Qt-interest] C++ + QT vs C#
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Qyoto does not try to replicate .NET and it has nothing to do with
>> what MainSoft did.
>>
>> Qyoto is just a C# binding to Qt, nothing less, nothing more. It
>> allows you to develop Qt applications using C# instead of C++, on
>> Windows (using Microsoft's CLR and .NET), Linux (and *BSD, Solaris,
>> etc) and Mac (using Mono). Like Qt Jambi did for Java using the JVM.
>>
>> There are other Qt bindings for languages such as Ruby, Python, PHP,
>> Falcon, Lisp and more, by the way. It's not a matter of platform
>> (Linux, Windows, etc) but a matter of using a particular programming
>> language (C#, Java, etc). A long time ago, there were even pure C
>> bindings to Qt.
>>
>> is like Qt Jambi
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 3:34 PM, Scott Aron Bloom
>> <Scott.Bloom at sabgroup.com> wrote:
>> > Im not sure why there is a project for this...
>> >
>> > Build your application with CLR turned on, and call all the C# you want.  I
>> haven't tried it, but since QT is linked in dynamically, it shouldn't be a
>> problem.
>> >
>> > And I certainly don't understand why someone would want to use C# on unix...
>> seriously... why?  You have Java..
>> >
>> > And the reality is...C# was designed to kill Java... but lets not turn this
>> into a C# vs Java flame war...
>> >
>> >
>> > The CLR system is REALLY cool,being able to "include" a DLL and be able to
>> instantiate C# or C++ or VB or Java objects in C++ really is quite a lot
>> easier than using active X/COM calls...
>> >
>> > But Im still confused... why use C++/Qt and C# on a linux based system?
>>  What does C# bring there...
>> >
>> > On windows, I could see it, there are TONS of libs being put out in C# with
>> CLR, but without a functional .NET framework for the C# code to run against..
>> why bother?   I can only assume the Qyoto projects main effort is to duplicate
>> the .NET framework, which frankly reminds me of what MainSoft tried to do..
>> and failed..
>> >
>> > Scott
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From: Pau Garcia i Quiles [mailto:pgquiles at elpauer.org]
>> >> Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 3:54 AM
>> >> To: Scott Aron Bloom
>> >> Cc: qt-interest at trolltech.com
>> >> Subject: Re: [Qt-interest] C++ + QT vs C#
>> >>
>> >> Hello,
>> >>
>> >> How about combining C# and Qt by using the Qt C# bindings (Qyoto) ? :-)
>> >>
>> >> http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Languages/Qyoto
>> >>
>> >> A (very nice) application which uses Qyoto:
>> >> http://synapse.im/
>> >>
>> >> 2009/3/19 Scott Aron Bloom <Scott.Bloom at sabgroup.com>:
>> >> > Hope all you QT people like my numbers.. I'm pretty proud of them.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > So I've been working on a project for a client, and the previous
>> consultant
>> >> > (who had to leave the project but Im friends with) is a C# guy... Loves
>> C# etc
>> >> > etc...  Claims the performance is great and that Im full of $%#@ when I
>> say
>> >> > Ill stick with C++ when and I need performance...  And even if I don't..
>> Ill
>> >> > still take C++ J
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > In taking over the project, essentially we had to be able to read in a
>> tab
>> >> > separated file, with a random header, and insert it into a new table,
>> using
>> >> > the first row as the field names of the database.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > He wrote it in C# and had all but the insert into DB working.. Now.. I
>> >> > didn't like his style (he read the whole file in at once and then used a
>> >> > string splitter to split the lines...
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Initially its app sat at 450MB to read in the 118k rows due to having the
>> >> > whole thing in memory + each line in memory...
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Well we both wrote it to be read 1 line, process 1 line, maybe a bit
>> slower...
>> >> > but not much..
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >                 C++(Console) C++(GUI)                C#
>> >> >
>> >> > Memory before loading anything             6MB
>> >> > 9MB       22MB
>> >> >
>> >> > Memory after reading each line
>> >> >
>> >> > and inserting into DB
>> >> > 6MB                       9MB       180MB (love heap managers...)
>> >> >
>> >> > Memory after show db in GUI
>> >> >
>> >> > In QT using QSqlQueryModel and
>> >> > QAbstractTableModel
>> >> > NA                          12MB    450MB
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Runtime to load                with NO DB connection
>> >> >
>> >> > (release mode)                                 3s
>> >> > 3s            9s
>> >> >
>> >> > Runtime to load with DB inserts
>> >> > 210s                       210s       540s
>> >> >
>> >> > Runtime to show in GUI
>> >> > NA                          .5s          3.3s
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Size of data...
>> >> >
>> >> > ~118k rows of 105 columns of ~50 filled columns.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > BTW.. I cant use BULK IMPORT commands because they are not SQL database
>> >> > agnostic.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Scott
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> > Qt-interest mailing list
>> >> > Qt-interest at trolltech.com
>> >> > http://lists.trolltech.com/mailman/listinfo/qt-interest
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Pau Garcia i Quiles
>> >> http://www.elpauer.org
>> >> (Due to my workload, I may need 10 days to answer)
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Pau Garcia i Quiles
>> http://www.elpauer.org
>> (Due to my workload, I may need 10 days to answer)
>
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-- 
Pau Garcia i Quiles
http://www.elpauer.org
(Due to my workload, I may need 10 days to answer)